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Improving - Chrisrox - 28-07-2015

Update after completing the 6x1k on day 8 as planned today:

Day 4: Rest as prescribed
Day 5: Longest run, did 27,5k in 2:23:42 for an avg pace of 5:13 min/km with avg HR 149. The run can be divided in two parts:
1) The first 12k relaxed and easy with avg pace of 5:39 and avg HR 139
2) Last 15,5k with pace 4:58 min/km and avg HR 157 (Tried staying in the top end of my estimated HR zone 2 (fat burning, 141-160), but had a total of 15 mins in the low end of HR zone 3 (aerobic, 161-170)).
Did not eat or drink anything but some water during the run and felt strong throughout, certainly was tired towards the end, but would have had no problems continuing if required.
Day 6: skipped the 30 mins easy run and went hiking 6-7k with the family
Day 7: 9,2k easy in 48:25 for avg pace 5:16 and avg HR 144.
Day 8: Before the 6x1k session today I was afraid that I had not recovered fully from the two tough workouts on day 3 and 5, but as the results show, I was able to perform as planned (target pace of 3:40):

Time AvgHR MaxHR MinHR
3:41 171 179 118
3:39 174 180 122
3:39 175 182 126
3:38 176 183 125
3:38 177 183 126
3:40 177 185 129
21:55 equals 3:39,2 min/km

Again a tough workout, felt less controlled than the 2k session, but very motivational to perform as planned and to see the consistent pace improvement (the last rep included some hills, explaining the increase in time).

Looking forward to a few easy days ahead of the 5k paced on Saturday.

I have a 23,5k mountain trail race with a tough profile (very hilly with 3 main peaks) on the 8th of August (race day of current cycle). Do you think I should do any adjustments to the program to optimize for this race?

If not, I am thinking of doing the 5k paced in around 19:30 and do the 400m session in 3:30 pace as prescribed.

Improving - TheEd - 28-07-2015

good load of training

if you decide to race the trail race then let me know


Improving - Chrisrox - 29-07-2015

Yes, I am racing the mountain trial race, should be a good test for me at the end of the cycle and I will also compete against a couple of friends, which is always good. For me it also serves as a good quality training session leading up to the marathon, which is six weeks after the mountain trial race. Right in the middle, 3 weeks after mountain trial and 3 weeks before the marathon, there is a half marathon which i am considering (raced it last year in 1.26:14, my PB).

I am starting to get curious about the 6 week marathon program you mentioned earlier. Wondering about the content and also if the half marathon
can be slotted in (not necessarily racing at full speed).

Reminds me that I have signed up for a 5 x 5 km relay race on the 20th of August also, so I guess the complete "want to race" calendar looks like this:

Sat 8th of August: 23,5k mountain trial race. Decided.
Thursday 20th of August: 5 x 5 km relay race (I will run 5k). Decided, but do not need to race at full throttle
Sunday 30th of August: Half marathon. Want to run if it is beneficial towards the marathon (not necessarily full throttle), otherwise not
Saturday 19th of September: Marathon

Improving - TheEd - 30-07-2015

Chris, we need to slot a 30k training run in, sometime soon

and then instead of the 1k session we need to introduce a stronger rolling hills session

have you a route you able to use for this

you maintain the 2k session


Improving - Chrisrox - 30-07-2015

Good, thanks!

I'll find a route for the rolling hills session. I am not familiar with this workout, what is the optimal length and profile of the route?

As for the 30k, you thinking I should do it already before the race next Saturday, just 9 days from now? If so, on which day and how should the rest of the current cycle be adjusted to accommodate for the 30k?

By the way, the hilly race is the one in 9 days from now, sorry I have not been clearer about this. If the rolling hills workout is targeting this race it is already to late I am afraid. However, if you introduce the rolling hills for the purpose of the marathon, then all is good.


Improving - TheEd - 03-08-2015

30k run .. 6 weeks and 3 weeks before marathon

find a route for rolling hills, where you can run back & forth the hill is maybe 50 to 100m in length, can be light incline to medium

you work the hills and jog relaxed downhill

you keep the 2k session every 2 weeks with the hillwork replacing the 1k session

you drop week 3 of the 10k cycle

please ask more questions


Improving - Chrisrox - 04-08-2015

Thanks for the feedback!

This is my workouts since last update:
Day 9: felt tired and decided to skip the 30 min easy and take a rest day
Day 10: 5,52 km in 29:48, avg pace 5:24 and avg HR 140 plus 30 mins easy biking
Day 11: rest as prescribed
Day 12: 5k semi-hilly route in 20:15, avg pace 4:03 and avg HR 175
Day 13: 17,8 km semi-hilly in 1:42:16, avg pace 5:46 and avg HR 144. Pushed my 3 year old in a kids jogger/trolley.
Day 14: 6k semi-hilly in 29:22, avg pace 4:53 and avg HR 148

Still do not have it all clear about the program going forward, think it is better to look at the calendar visually, see enclosed image.

Some comments:
- First row (with black text) contains the prescribed workout according to the 10K / Marathon program
- Second row (with red text on yellow background) contains my races and/or proposed adjustment to the program

My concerns and questions are:
1) The 30K run 6 weeks before the marathon collides with the mountain trial race. Suggesting to do the mountain trial race and postpone the 30K run to week 5 before the marathon, as shown in the picture
2) Racing a 5K (relay with 4 friends, I race 5K) on the 20th of August instead of the 5K paced on the 22nd of August. Planning a easy long run (20K?) on the 22nd of August
3) The 30K run 3 weeks before the marathon collides with the half marathon I am considering. The half marathon is only up if you think it is beneficial towards my Marathon performance 3 weeks later, otherwise it is off. Hence I believe there are two options:
3a) skip half marathon and do the 30K on 29th of August, 3 weeks before the marathon
3b) race half marathon and fill 29th Aug with 30 min easy, then do 30K on 5th of Sept, 2 weeks before the marathon


Improving - Chrisrox - 04-08-2015

Noticed the attached image was reduced in size and hard to read, trying again. Please see previous post for comments and questions.

Improving - TheEd - 05-08-2015

we will have to juggle things around a little

however you could consider a 5k warm up before the half marathon and 5k warm down afterwards

there are certain elements you need to have a satisfactory marathon, and racing shorter events is often not beneficial to marathon racing

but if you not expecting too much from the marathon, then enjoying what you are doing is of more benefit


Improving - Chrisrox - 16-08-2015

Great thanks, I will skip the half marathon and prioritize a 30K+ run then.

Time for an update on my running. Sorry in advance for the long post, lots to share and log.

Day 15: 10 x 400m on tartan track, almost all done in 82-83 secs, with avg HR around 165 and max around 177 for most of the intervals after the first few. The last I completed faster, in 75 secs with avg HR 168 and max 181. Definitive improvement over three weeks earlier, with 6 seconds quicker total time and avg HR down from 169 to 162 (avg of avg HR during the intervals)

Day 16: 8,09 km easy in 39:55 for avg pace 4:56 and avg HR 148.
Day 17: Rest
Day 18: 30 km mountainbiking towing a trailer with my 3 year old. Very easy pace (avg HR of 118) and spent 2 hr 15 minutes on the bike, excluding a long break halfway. I know this is far from the best way to prepare for a race the day after, but hey, it was not an important race and I had a good time biking with a friend and our kids.

Day 19 and race day: Raced the mountain trail run, which turned out to be 22K. Hilly route, lots of technical sections with rocky trails and some marsh sections which were extremely soggy, tough and heavy and just some 5-6 kms of dirt road divided in two easy sections. Finished in 1:53:13 which was OK, but not great IMHO. Avg pace 5:09 and avg HR only 170, reflecting the technical nature of the race and also the fact that this type of race is really not my thing (I am comparatively better on flat asphalt or hard surface races) and felt I was not really able to push hard. The worst part was being absolutely trashed by my friend, who came in 5 mins faster (it's his kind of race profile and terrain though). At least I beat my other friends' wife with a minute or so. Also did a few kms of both warm up and warm down.

Day 20: mountainbiking 24 km in 1 hr 45 mins, very easy recovery with avg HR of only 106.
Day 21: 6 km easy in 32 mins for avg pace 5:20 and avg HR 140

Started the 2 week marathon cycle outlined by you. Due to family and priorities I decided to start day 1 of the cycle on Wednesday, hence the day 0 below, which is Tuesday

Day 0: 12 km in 59:23 for avg pace 4:57. No HR data.
Day 1: 8 km in 46:59, extremely easy with avg pace of 5:52 and avg HR of 128.
Day 2: Skipped the 30 min easy and had a rest day
Day 3: 5 x 2k. Details below
Day 4: rest
Day 5: Long run 31,7 km in 2:51:25 for avg pace 5:24 and avg HR 150. Quite hilly route, which I ran controlled and nice for the first 20k, but during the last 12 I noticed HR drifting upwards while pace was stable. Legs were sore during the last few kms and was running out of gas. Only had water with some blackcurrant juice during the run, i.e. did not eat or take energy bars or gels, and I believe I was approaching my limit without consuming calories as I felt tired and out of fuel towards the end. I plan to test energy gels and more water/juice during my next long run.

5 x 2k:
# Time AvgHR MaxHR MinHR
1 07:35,1 166 177 112
2 07:34,7 173 180 127
3 07:37,1 175 182 127
4 07:30,3 177 183 129
5 07:32,6 177 184 125
Sum 37:49,8 174 184 112
Avg 03:47,0

Very pleased with these results, where the total time was almost a minute faster than 3 weeks ago (avg HR the same). Slightly faster route than last time, but definitively a nice improvement. Thanks for the program, clearly works!

Now for the questions:
- I am running a 5 x 5 K relay on Thursday (day 9) in Stockholm. Was thinking of an easy and short recovery run tomorrow, then the rolling hills Tuesday, before a short and easy run on Wednesday, leading up to this 5k. What do you think about this plan? Not important to perform at my best in the relay race, but would like to finish in around 19 mins.
- Since the above 5 k replaces the 5k paced of day 12, I was thinking of going on a long run again in the weekend, aiming for 20-25k. What do you think?

All my efforts are now geared towards the marathon on the 19th of Sept, but the 5 x 5 relay is a social thing with colleagues and friends that I do not want to miss.

Thanks again for your program and advice TheEd, I highly appreciate it and the results already speak for themselves!