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+--- Thread: Sub 40 within reach? (/Thread-Sub-40-within-reach)
Sub 40 within reach? - TheEd - 23-05-2013
Hi NR .. we train to race .. if we race too often we cannot train .. therefore we land up racing on empty
during the many races currently, you can only focus on AEROBIC runs, what we recommend here is up to 1hr and currently only every 2nd day to allow for us much recovery as possible
soon you would need to go onto an off-period to get rid of all the niggles and then build back up
we have a race period for the more elite, do look at it but realise this is aimed at athletes who have the experience and background to do this without fear of breakdown
http://www.time-to-run.com/training/10k/race-period.htm
NR, you need to be careful to know that at any time your performances can drop off and that you can go stale, you in a decent space now but try to avoid the signs of over doing things
http://www.time-to-run.com/training/overtraining/warnings.htm
this may be overtraining signals however they also apply to over racing
do monitor the knee
TheEd
ps.. hope this helps
Sub 40 within reach? - NordicRunner - 27-05-2013
Managed to reproduce a "sub 40" race this weekend (39:54). Will be back with some more details regarding splits / HR, but just wanted to inform you about the result. Which I think is totally satisfying. The course was a bit less hilly than the 39:02-race I ran a month a go, but with slightly more turns and some quite slow trail parts. My goal was actually "only" to reproduce sub 40, so I`m more than ok with that :yes:
Now the focus is on 21 k trail June 8th. That will be a much tougher challenge. Do you have any recommandations? I`m not trying to achieve "great" result, just want to be as good prepared as possible, given the present situation.
Will take a recovery run today after complete rest day yesterday. Thinking of taking an "off period" from mid June or from start of July.
Sub 40 within reach? - TheEd - 27-05-2013
nice going NR .. there is not much you can change and do before the Half Trail
on race day you must start off a little slower and set a time for 10km then 15km and then onto 18km, from then on you will most likely find it difficult
how difficult will depend on what target times you set for yourself in all the splits
so over to you
TheEd
Sub 40 within reach? - NordicRunner - 28-05-2013
I know... not much time to do anything special to prepare for the 21 k now.
The "split scheduling" is a difficult one. But I`ll give it a try:
10 k: 46 min
15 k: 1h 8 min
18 k: 1h 22 min
21 k: sub 1.35
I think this may be a decent plan, as this is a tougher route than street half maratons. I`ve been told that you should expect to run it approximately 10 minutes slower than a street half marathon.
have a look at the route here, if you like:
http://www.birkebeiner.no/Global/Kart/L%c3%b8ypeprofiler/L%c3%b8p/L%c3%b8ypeprofil%20Birkebeinerl%c3%b8pet%20ny.pdf
As you will see the first 5 k are up hill.
Do you think my splits look reasonable? :mmm:
And by the way: What do you think of sessions like these:
1) hill intervals (not sure what length, maybe up to 1 k?)
2) intervals that are longer than 2k (e.g. 3 x 3 k)
These are both tips I`ve received from another more experienced runner, so I thought about maybe doing one of them today
Sub 40 within reach? - TheEd - 28-05-2013
Your splits seem reasonable though keep in mind you not really looking for a performance target and if you able to get to 18km feeling great you may have a nice run and result
as for the questions:
because these are online programs and from my experience we try to avoid doing 'everything' at once
with the programs they change as you go through the cycles, the aim is to deliver results with the least amount of work and disruption to one's normal life
when these programs have been used in a 'squad training' scenario where we were able to monitor the athlete on a one on one basis we were able to do a lot more without any breakdown to the athletes
during our winter (southern hemisphere) we participate in cross country, so the cycles would change accordingly and hillwork would be more regular
the 10k programs have been utilised quite effectively over half marathon with the athletes in the squad where the times ranged from 62 minutes to 84 minutes and if you look at the sub 31 minute 10k program you will note hillwork is mentioned there
all of the runners under 35 minutes for 10km did hillwork on that day, which is Day 5
so once your running evolves after the build-up program maybe you will include hillwork into your routine, however it must be noted, we train to race and achieve, setting short term and long-term goals, and from these 'ideals' you can always assess where you stand
do as little as possible to achieve current results, so that 'specific training' can be applied at a later stage
RECOVERY from training is most important, so keeping it simple is ideal when new to the sport
as for the 3 x 3k training, it all depends what the session is intended to achieve, currently the 2k session is aimed at achieving 'speed endurance' in the most effective way for racing 10km (which has shown to get good results up to and including 21km)
I hope this helps
TheEd
Sub 40 within reach? - NordicRunner - 31-05-2013
Back with some data and cofenssions
These are the facts from my last weekend 10 k race.
The splits from my Garmin watch actually adds up to 40:00, but my official time was 39:54.
I note that my avarage HR was a bit higher in this race than the 39:02 race a month ago (189). Guess it could be many explanations for that. It was at least 6 degrees C warmer, and my condition was perhaps slightly reduced. Also - I think the course was actually a bit more challenging, with less meter on concrete, and more turns and narrow paths.
k min/k height+/-HRav HRmax
1 3:43 1/0 182 192
2 4:00 8/0 192 196
3 3:57 1/6 193 196
4 4:01 0/2 193 196
5 4:08 6/4 194 197
6 4:03 2/4 193 196
7 4:07 5/0 193 196
8 4:06 4/10 194 198
9 4:04 4/6 195 199
10 3:51 1/4 196 201
tot 39:54 37/36 192 201
Sunday was rest day
Monday I did this: 7k, 40 minutes, av HR 135
Tuesday I went for another easy run, without HR monitor (approx. 45 min)
Wednesday another rest day
Yesterday I wanted to get in a new quality session, despite your advice of sticking to aerobic sessions during these rather busy race weeks. I guess I felt like needing it, to keep up.
Stuck with the 5x2k - after your last answer. For the first time I did a quality session "out in the free", that is: not on a tread mill or on a track. I guess the results should be read in light of this. I wasn`t able to deliever a consistent session. I really "got it" from the 4th lap onwards, and had to see an increasing drop in pace.
1 3:55 161 178
2 3:55 179 182
1st lap7:50 170 182
3 3:55 171 184
4 3:56 181 187
2nd lap7:51 176 187
5 3:59 174 184
6 3:54 185 189
3rd lap7:53 179 189
7 4:00 176 186
8 4:03 185 188
4th lap8:03 180 188
9 4:09 176 195
10 4:10 182 187
5th lap8:19 179 187
The majority of the session was quite flat, on gravel. Just a little part of each round was on concrete. I noticed each time that my speed increased when going from gravel to concrete. So I guess this may explain the "breakdown" for the last two laps. Another excuse / explanation may be the quite late evening time of this session (21.40-22.30), which is later than I normally would do such a session (I have today off from work, so knew that I could sleep a little longer).
Lastly, of course, it seems that the starting laps went too fast for my current condition. But I don`t think it would have looked quite like this on a track.
Today legs is expectedly tired and will rest.
21 k next Saturday. Looking forwards to that :great:
Sub 40 within reach? - NordicRunner - 31-05-2013
Would like to correct my self: legs don't feel that tired, actually feel ok.
Only the expected light soreness. Nothing to worry about
And knees have not been complaining lately:great:
Sub 40 within reach? - TheEd - 31-05-2013
good to see the body is still serving you well
hope you give it a reward soon
TheEd
Sub 40 within reach? - NordicRunner - 31-05-2013
Well, I'm giving it one right now, as a matter of fact!
(An ice cold beer, to be precise
)However, I don't think it'll be too happy tomorrow. Which is Moving Day... Including lot's of heavy lifting and stair walking and organization of total chaos. Come to think of it, I'm sure it will feel that next weekends 21 hilly k is piece of cake, compared to a Moving Day
Sub 40 within reach? - TheEd - 03-06-2013
how did the move go
